I'm appreciating how you tied Zeus turning into a swan to modern Hollywood glamour. It's power dressing itself up as beauty so we don't notice the muscle underneath. The yacht and private jet comparison for Helen made me chuckle because it's so true. Much of what we covet is really just wanting to win the competition for it.
I appreciate you reading and supporting my work :). Zeus, or power in general, has always worked with beauty to seduce us instead of simply scaring us. All those beautiful artworks, churches, and temples would not exist without that need, and this also has positive aspectsBut when everything turns into rivalry, fights, and arguments, I become more critical. I do not want to end up in wars like Odysseus, chasing some eidolon.
Stupendously reasonable! Also I'll have to put my hand up to admitting I'd never encountered the word "eidolon" before, outside Warhammer 40k's character Lord Eidolon, who if you're unfamiliar with the 40k universe, is a member of a race of 'roided-up and GE-bolstered super-soldiers called Space Marines: https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Eidolon Lord Eidolon is a pompous preening asshole even by Space Marine standards. Googling tells me the actual word "eidolon" is a ghostly flavour of idealised mental image. Hah. Typical of Lord Eidolon to name himself like that.
I had never heard of Lord Eidolon, that made me laugh inside :D. The word comes from Ancient Greek. I was not sure whether most people would know it, but since it is related to the word idol and sounds similar, I thought people might connect it in their minds :)).
Glad you enjoyed reading. It was also very interesting to write, because it let my mind wander and connect the dots between Zeus, the swan, Helen, and what the nature of beauty could be. These are definitely motifs I am going to return to in the future :))
"He is interested less in Helen as a person than in what having her would mean." Helen as the ultimate symbol of beauty, but also with the "possession" of beauty, there comes true power maybe. Perhaps both sides, in some way or another, realized that brute strength isn't enough to be truly great. It needs something more, and this "more" seems to be Helen. Anyway, a very interesting read!
Thanks for your insights. I would place Paris’s choice in the context of the competition between the goddesses. By rejecting Hera and Athena, he rejects political power, kingship, wisdom, and victory in war. He chooses beauty instead, but beauty separated from the qualities that could give it substance In this sense, Helen becomes an empty signifier. Paris chooses the symbol without understanding what stands behind it. It is similar to modern people chasing symbols of prestige without understanding what those symbols are supposed to represent. I may edit a few sentences in my text to make this idea clearer.:)
Hmm, okay. Btw, what would your say is your underlining paradigm that you are interpreting the ancients myth from? Is it more of a secular, allegorical perspective or mixture of different ones? Would be interesting to know.
My approach is definitely theological readings mixed with modern cultural analysis and critique. I approach biblical texts in the same way. For me, secularism is Protestant theology becoming the basis of modern thinking, but so internalised that we no longer see it as belief. We treat it as neutral reason, even though it is still built on assumptions and axioms that are not empirically proven.
I do not see a fundamental difference between what I am doing and the way nineteenth-century theologianssuch as Schleiermacher and Dilthey developed hermeneutics as a basis for the Geisteswissenschaften. If biblical texts can be read as inspired works that reveal something about our relationship with God, then other great works can also be approached through a theological lens. They may deepen our understanding of human existence and help us return to the biblical corpus with new questions. Hermeneutics already recognised that we never read from a neutral position because our understanding is shaped by history and culture. Gadamer developed this further by describing interpretation as an encounter between the horizon of the text and the horizon of the reader. This is how I understand cultural theology. Greek myths present a very different vision of the divine, suffering and human experience. By confronting these texts with the secular Christian culture( doing cultural critics)in which I live, I become more aware of the assumptions shaping my own understanding of reality and the divine. My reading of Greek myth is also a preparation for rereading the Bible. Christianity emerged within the Greek and Roman world and presented itself as an answer to many of its philosophical questions. To understand that answer, we first need to understand the world to which it responded.
Glad you enjoyed reading ✨ For me, the question of Helen’s beauty opened so many other questions. What creates what we consider beautiful? Is it enough that others fight for someone, or desire someone, for us to find that person attractive too? And many more. I am definitely going back to these topics someday.:)
Sometimes it takes several attempts to write about the same topic before you reach its deeper layers. I am glad to have found such a thoughtful reader. :))
I thought it was so thoughtful how you shifted the focus from Helen herself to the idea of the image we create around people. It made me think about how often we mistake admiration for understanding. Sometimes we aren't pursuing a person at all, but a story we've attached to them. I think this happens more often than people realize. It made me think of all the trending attachment theories that are out there. Specifically the anxious attachment theory. This was so good! Going to sub so I can read more of your work!
Particularly enjoyed the Hollywood as a framing. It made the whole essay even more nuanced. Helen and the exclusive car makes her an object, instead of what her image is supposed to portray. Very smart put!
Thank you. I think power and beauty have always worked in a similar way, both in ancient and modern times. Making the casting of Helen controversial was a really smart move by Nolan, because it turns beauty itself into a question of projection.
I see what you mean with the buzz created by casting Lupita. I disagree though, if they want to make a diverse movie, they should pick a diverse story instead of reimagining exising work. But thats just my preference.
I would not say that I like the move. I would say that I understand the logic of getting attention through rivalry, because it works so well. So it is more like praise for the fact that it works, not an idealistic position about how it should be. In my perfect world, I do not even like the translation of Odysseus he uses, because it feels too directly ideological. It makes the language plain and judgemental, as if a modern person were sitting there judging the book instead of trying to translate it. The main idea of the movie, breaking civilisation by breaking the law of the gods and becoming sea peoples who bring collapse, is interesting. But its actualy about American civilisation. The whole movie feels like self projection, and that is why, for me, writing about Hollywood made so much sense.
What I find most interesting is how you bring the myth into contemporary culture and show how easily we end up fighting over images and symbols, forgetting what is actually real.
Good observation, that we often fight for eidolons most of the time. It is actually very interesting how wanting works. Can we want something if no one else is fighting for it? What gives value to things? How much of what we do is still meaningful without a real or imagined public?Those are philosophical and psychological questions, but so many stories also ask them through their narratives. So its really fun to explore those topics.
I'm appreciating how you tied Zeus turning into a swan to modern Hollywood glamour. It's power dressing itself up as beauty so we don't notice the muscle underneath. The yacht and private jet comparison for Helen made me chuckle because it's so true. Much of what we covet is really just wanting to win the competition for it.
I appreciate you reading and supporting my work :). Zeus, or power in general, has always worked with beauty to seduce us instead of simply scaring us. All those beautiful artworks, churches, and temples would not exist without that need, and this also has positive aspectsBut when everything turns into rivalry, fights, and arguments, I become more critical. I do not want to end up in wars like Odysseus, chasing some eidolon.
Stupendously reasonable! Also I'll have to put my hand up to admitting I'd never encountered the word "eidolon" before, outside Warhammer 40k's character Lord Eidolon, who if you're unfamiliar with the 40k universe, is a member of a race of 'roided-up and GE-bolstered super-soldiers called Space Marines: https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Eidolon Lord Eidolon is a pompous preening asshole even by Space Marine standards. Googling tells me the actual word "eidolon" is a ghostly flavour of idealised mental image. Hah. Typical of Lord Eidolon to name himself like that.
I had never heard of Lord Eidolon, that made me laugh inside :D. The word comes from Ancient Greek. I was not sure whether most people would know it, but since it is related to the word idol and sounds similar, I thought people might connect it in their minds :)).
Ah! "Eidolon" shares etymological roots with "idol", does it? That makes a ton of sense 🤘😁
Great read, such an interesting topic to explore
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This is a very interesting analysis! I enjoyed this very much, thank you!
Glad you enjoyed reading. It was also very interesting to write, because it let my mind wander and connect the dots between Zeus, the swan, Helen, and what the nature of beauty could be. These are definitely motifs I am going to return to in the future :))
"He is interested less in Helen as a person than in what having her would mean." Helen as the ultimate symbol of beauty, but also with the "possession" of beauty, there comes true power maybe. Perhaps both sides, in some way or another, realized that brute strength isn't enough to be truly great. It needs something more, and this "more" seems to be Helen. Anyway, a very interesting read!
Thanks for your insights. I would place Paris’s choice in the context of the competition between the goddesses. By rejecting Hera and Athena, he rejects political power, kingship, wisdom, and victory in war. He chooses beauty instead, but beauty separated from the qualities that could give it substance In this sense, Helen becomes an empty signifier. Paris chooses the symbol without understanding what stands behind it. It is similar to modern people chasing symbols of prestige without understanding what those symbols are supposed to represent. I may edit a few sentences in my text to make this idea clearer.:)
Hmm, okay. Btw, what would your say is your underlining paradigm that you are interpreting the ancients myth from? Is it more of a secular, allegorical perspective or mixture of different ones? Would be interesting to know.
My approach is definitely theological readings mixed with modern cultural analysis and critique. I approach biblical texts in the same way. For me, secularism is Protestant theology becoming the basis of modern thinking, but so internalised that we no longer see it as belief. We treat it as neutral reason, even though it is still built on assumptions and axioms that are not empirically proven.
How would you define “theological” in this context? I am curious.
I do not see a fundamental difference between what I am doing and the way nineteenth-century theologianssuch as Schleiermacher and Dilthey developed hermeneutics as a basis for the Geisteswissenschaften. If biblical texts can be read as inspired works that reveal something about our relationship with God, then other great works can also be approached through a theological lens. They may deepen our understanding of human existence and help us return to the biblical corpus with new questions. Hermeneutics already recognised that we never read from a neutral position because our understanding is shaped by history and culture. Gadamer developed this further by describing interpretation as an encounter between the horizon of the text and the horizon of the reader. This is how I understand cultural theology. Greek myths present a very different vision of the divine, suffering and human experience. By confronting these texts with the secular Christian culture( doing cultural critics)in which I live, I become more aware of the assumptions shaping my own understanding of reality and the divine. My reading of Greek myth is also a preparation for rereading the Bible. Christianity emerged within the Greek and Roman world and presented itself as an answer to many of its philosophical questions. To understand that answer, we first need to understand the world to which it responded.
Such an interesting topic of discussion. Didn't want it to end. I enjoyed this.
Glad you enjoyed reading ✨ For me, the question of Helen’s beauty opened so many other questions. What creates what we consider beautiful? Is it enough that others fight for someone, or desire someone, for us to find that person attractive too? And many more. I am definitely going back to these topics someday.:)
I can't wait to see how you revisit these topics!
Sometimes it takes several attempts to write about the same topic before you reach its deeper layers. I am glad to have found such a thoughtful reader. :))
I thought it was so thoughtful how you shifted the focus from Helen herself to the idea of the image we create around people. It made me think about how often we mistake admiration for understanding. Sometimes we aren't pursuing a person at all, but a story we've attached to them. I think this happens more often than people realize. It made me think of all the trending attachment theories that are out there. Specifically the anxious attachment theory. This was so good! Going to sub so I can read more of your work!
Particularly enjoyed the Hollywood as a framing. It made the whole essay even more nuanced. Helen and the exclusive car makes her an object, instead of what her image is supposed to portray. Very smart put!
Thank you. I think power and beauty have always worked in a similar way, both in ancient and modern times. Making the casting of Helen controversial was a really smart move by Nolan, because it turns beauty itself into a question of projection.
I see what you mean with the buzz created by casting Lupita. I disagree though, if they want to make a diverse movie, they should pick a diverse story instead of reimagining exising work. But thats just my preference.
I would not say that I like the move. I would say that I understand the logic of getting attention through rivalry, because it works so well. So it is more like praise for the fact that it works, not an idealistic position about how it should be. In my perfect world, I do not even like the translation of Odysseus he uses, because it feels too directly ideological. It makes the language plain and judgemental, as if a modern person were sitting there judging the book instead of trying to translate it. The main idea of the movie, breaking civilisation by breaking the law of the gods and becoming sea peoples who bring collapse, is interesting. But its actualy about American civilisation. The whole movie feels like self projection, and that is why, for me, writing about Hollywood made so much sense.
I completely agree with you on every point! I crinkled the whole movie, part of me was heartbroken.
I enjoyed this piece a lot!
What I find most interesting is how you bring the myth into contemporary culture and show how easily we end up fighting over images and symbols, forgetting what is actually real.
Good observation, that we often fight for eidolons most of the time. It is actually very interesting how wanting works. Can we want something if no one else is fighting for it? What gives value to things? How much of what we do is still meaningful without a real or imagined public?Those are philosophical and psychological questions, but so many stories also ask them through their narratives. So its really fun to explore those topics.
🦋💜
🌻📖☕✨
Amazing
Glad you enjoyd reading 📖☕🐦:)))
This sent me down a rabbit hole. lol! Another great read.
Always glad to give some ideas to think about. Maybe not exactly a rabbit hole, but at least something worth thinking about.:)